The feeble minds of aging North American men in relation to understanding Central American culture

LaFoca's picture

I was reading the analysis of a few North American men in another site with relation to Central American men and had to laugh at the levels of naivety. Here is a snippet of the conclusions at least one has reached that amused me to no end.

"Actually it has been my experience that most Latin males are better at courting, "wooing", and or seducing Latin women or actually women in general. IMO, the previous is due to their mothers being the main presence in their lives, they are more adept at superficially pleasing and flirting with a woman than most Gringos are. It is a cultural thing. We have all heard the phrase "Latin Lover", but I have never heard the phrase "Gringo Lover" or "WASP Lover" and there has to be a reason for that."

Now, as much as I would love to believe Latin American men have this sexual prowess from RGV AG' statement on the TRN site, I have to admit that I was doubled over in laughter having read this analysis . As a Latina, my experience with the so-called "Latin Lover" has been as varied as my experiences with any other culture, including North American Anglos. Latino lovers come in all degrees of experience and proficiency "wooing and seducing women." Some are quite adept at it and others have the emotional maturity of a junior high school prepubescent boy, almost fearing women to such an extent that they have a gender phobia.

The reasons for this in many cases may be historical, because throughout history machismo, which is known to have originated uniquely in Spain and carried over the Atlantic Ocean during the Spanish Conquest; was not an indigenous tradition. Mesoamericans were traditionally a matriarchal society, where women were valued until the Spanish Conquest. Women continued to bear a major responsibility for the culture even after it was driven underground by Spanish priests. Because of this stilted view of women brought over by the Spaniards, socioeconomic classes were linked to “whiteness,” which with rape and denial of "bastard" children created machismo. Thus many Latino men over 50 still harbor a high degree of machismo, while newer generations have a more advanced view of women.

Read more: Machismo - Bibliography

http://science.jrank.org/pages/7838/Machismo.html#ixzz0gIXobkno

In the following link, you will see that prevailing machismo attitudes tend to increase with age and decline with youth, which has been my experience as well. So if a woman dates a man over 50, she is almost twice as likely to deal with ancient attitudes as dating a man in his 20's. And that is exactly what many of my friends and I have noticed as well. And this reflects about the same age categories as machismo in North American cultures as well. Quite simply, it is the dinosaurs of most cultures who still value machismo, and the youth who finds it somewhat outdated even in young men in North America:

See the question above the graph here and the age groups who value machsimo.
http://www.zonalatina.com/Zldata77.htm

To quote:

"The survey results show that there is a systematic disjunction between men and women on this issue across all age groups and socio-economic levels. It is the traditional role for the male to provide for his wife and children. But with the social, political and economic upheavals of this century, women are receiving more schooling and entering the labor force. The macho man then feels that he is inadequate because he is unable to provide for his family, "like a real man." But the issue extends far more beyond an economic one in which a woman's earnings allow her great negotiating leverage vis-à-vis her husbands and male relatives. "With women working outside the home it's not just a question of them having their own money now, as important as this has been. What's also involved is that women have met all sorts of different people, which has changed them forever. And this has meant that the men have changed, for if they don't, more and more they're getting left behind by women." (Gutmann, p. 239).

RGV AG of the TRN site goes on to say:

"Most women I know in Latin America really do not complain to(sic) much about Latin male's performance either. What I base my opinion on is the follow through after the passion, lust, and romance. Obviously, and forgive me for generalizing, there are wonderful men, true and worthy men in Latin America. What I was stating is that due the culture, or poverty, or society, or a combination of the previous and all of the above the chances for a dead beat seem to be higher in Latin America. A big part of that, and this is my opinion, is that the initial nuclear family never truly turns loose of children, especially the males as they typically don't come with as much baggage or complications and can be counted on for extended financial support."

There is even more humor in that statement if one has lived among Latin males of today. For one thing, due to migratory patterns of Latin American men, there is often less dependence upon the nuclear family today, than ever before. This has resulted in the formation of pandillas or gangs, and so many other behaviors that reflect "baggage" in Latin culture. And the offshoot of these behaviors is that in many cases Latin women have turned outside the culture to seek qualified partners for marriage, and many have discovered little difference in the cultures and come BACK to Latin men as the result; realizing these behaviors are not necessarily culturally based, but gender based.

I believe North Americans like RGV AG of the TRN site base their naive assumptions on poorer communities and generalize that the behavior of the princesses of poverty who give them the time of day are relational to all Latin women and that is probably the most humorous thing of all. Having grown up around Latin women and many migrants, I've heard so many hilarious stories about the performance of men (Latino and Anglo alike) that his assumptions that we "do not complain too much about Latin male's performance" REALLY had me howling. Apparently, he has never seen shows in Spanish channels where women from all over Latin America are complaining about just that! I also find it ridiculous that men who have aged into their forties and suddenly arrive in Latin America with about 5 to 10 years experience dealing with peripheral edges to the culture, suddenly become experts on our culture, especially when they don't even speak the language. One wonders where they explore these preconceived notions if they can't even communicate effectively with people in the region, and especially when they only tend to surround themselves with the poorest people of the region. Is it based on the feelings of aging Latinos, who are still victimized by machismo attitudes? Is it based on the women they exploit who will tell them anything to get into their pocket books?

I shared the TRN site and my post with many of my Latina friends...people who grew up inside the culture, still have family there, and they were as amused (and disgusted in many cases) as I was. They felt these old leathery men were justifying their own prejudices and ignorance by making blanket statements that came across extremely xenophobic to my Latin friends. Why would that be, if these men's "truths" weren't so odd to us? There are any number of books out there, written by Latinos who are familiar with our culture that prove these types of statements as incorrect. Do any of these aging relics ever read?

This is why I think the idea of some of these sites is ridiculous. When a person moves to a new country and brings their xenophobic interpretations to the rest of the world it should be addressed. And when it is based on a tendency towards pedophilia, one has to wonder why we listen to them at all. Because as the news has broadcast repeatedly, many aging men move to developing countries for the express purpose of living their bizarre fetishes out, by targeting teen aged girls who live in abject poverty.

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Women in Latin America

Here in El Salvasor (I am not an intellectuall, I am a long term resident with family ties and lots of experiece) the problem is taht over 60% of the women are single mothers, raising kids on their own, some Fathers, with good intentions, went to USA to work illegally and at first sent Remesas home, however, out of sight, out of mind, many found other mates abraod and either stopped sending money home or sent less. Othres, males really to young and imature to take on role of Father, simply went away, leaving teh single mother and her family to raise the child or children. Single Mothers in El Salvador work hard, from selling clothing and cosmetics to impulsadoras, demonstrating products in stores, to secretaries and salespersons and yes some go to work as prostitutes, easy money for a few years for those inclined. I was censored on another forum for stating the above fact.
Older gringo men who relocate to Latin America for "love" have got to realize it is generally for money, many young and women in poverty equate money with love, many young females have asked me in teh past to either marry them or assist them in getting a visa for USA, I say no becuase I cannot and will not. I do not make promises I cannot keep.
The young Latina woman will go to teh Gringo when she is in dire straits and reqquires finacial help, however when things are good she will always return to her young Latin lover, abusive or not. Blood is thicker than water.
Young, handsome and fairly well off Gringos and Europeans often meet young profeessional women or students and decide to lie together or get married, often the woman is bi lingual, educated and sees a cahnce to leave, live and work abraod safely and legally, I know of several such couples.
Most people here from campesinos and obreros to IT professionals would leave El Salvador if they had the chance.
I am proud to be a citizen of a country where people want to get in, not get out.
I am for SECURING the US Border first, then giving an amnesty to those already there, law abiding.
India, China, Asia, Pakistan, Russia and West Africa to name a few send the USA educated English speaking immigrants, most of these illegals have overstayed student or tourist visas.
El Salvador was sending illegally obreros who learned their trade by 18th Century standards, and some joined Gangs to survive in an alien US culture.
Too many people, not enough work now.
Many Salvadorans I know who have returned voluntarily or have been deported use the N--------- word to describe African Americans (competition for jobs, rival gangs). Does not bother me. Asi es esto. I'm retired now and mind my own business. Fought for Free Speech, so they can have their opinion in their own country, with their own political system, corrupt or not, some of the time it works. but as any Government, most of the time we all need be proactive and stand on our two feet, help the really disadvangted when we are able.
Not a bleeding heart nor faint of heart.
Also a New Yorker, tough as nails, with a temper to match...I adapt, I cope, no hay problema
No one tells me what to write, say, or do unless they are paying my bills, all of them, on time, then and only then will I jump when you say jump and how high on the way up.
I am not politicaly correct and would never chastise a local for using n----- word or calling all Anglos racist or beleiving in teh Castro, Ortega, Chavez line of BS. To each his or her own.
If a man, with means, travels here and finds a good woman, more power to him! His time, his dime!
I often act, think and talk like a Latino but do not have authority to speak for anyone, including "Gringos" as a whole!!!!!
Enjoy life, it is short, let it be sweet.
saludos.

In the following post it just gets "curiouser and curiorser""

John Wayne says:

"Here in Nicaragua 14 to 18 years old is not Jail Bait for a man or woman of honorable intentions, Ask the parents permission, and done, like I did to my wife when she had 16 years old and a child with no father....She looked me, I did not her, we fell in love, pure and simple, have had our trying times, 3 more children, and are still together..."

ROFL! Yes, because we all know that a 14 year old girl looks at old geezers and says, "Ya know? I just gotta DO that!" PULEEASE!

No John Wayne, while your wholesale denial is humorous, she was looking at that bulge in your pocket where your money was, hon; not that other bulge. She was thinking like any other 14 year old girl living in abject poverty. "If I concentrate on the wall and don't look at his face, I can pretend he is (name the cute young guy down the street) and make a chunk of change. Heck! Maybe this old geezer will even buy me a car!" So she looked at you with dollar signs in her eyes and didn't observe the leathery skin, much the same way most young prostitutes do with THEIR "Johns." You were targeted by the oldest profession in the world, doll! And that you are so smugly in denial is what really makes it hilarious!

What wouldn't surprise me at all is if she is doing (name the cute young guy down the street) and laughing with him about how much money you spend on her, maybe even planning the right time to leave you.

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